The Secret to Communicating with Newborns
In this episode, we talk to Maria Etienne, a newborn specialist based in Connecticut, about the common cues to look for among all newborn babies, her top tips for all new parents, how to help dads bond with their babies, and the secret to getting any newborn baby to stop crying. Maria Etienne has over twenty years of experience as an expert in neonatal care who helps new parents during the first few weeks of life at home.
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TRANSCRIPT FOR SEASON 1, EPISODE 10 | The Secret to Communicating with Newborns
Intro: Welcome to The Matcha Guardians podcast, brought to you by matcha.com. Here we focus on the biggest trending health topics of our time, featuring the greatest and upcoming wellness advocates. Now, here are The Matcha Guardians, Certified Nutritionist, Diana Weil, and medical journalist, Elara Hadjipateras.
Diana Weil: Welcome, welcome to this week's episode. I am always excited about all of our guests, but particularly excited about this one. We have a Newborn Specialist on the podcast.
Elara Hadjipateras: Please help us welcome Maria Fernanda Etienne, a Newborn Specialist with over 20 years of experience that I personally have been working with during the last few weeks of postpartum. With Diana expecting, and myself going through it right now we thought, what better person to have on the podcast than Maria? So welcome.
Maria Fernanda Etienne: Hi. Thank you so much Elara and Diana.
Elara: How did you become a newborn specialist? How does one become a newborn specialist?
Maria: Well, this is actually a very interesting story because I actually graduated as a graphic designer, and I had my first son when I was very young, I was 18. As a first mom, a young mom, I actually didn't have the motherhood like my mom or my sister to support me to guide me, and I didn't know nothing. [laughs] My husband was there to support me, but unfortunately it was not what I was like looking for as a new mom. I did what I was able to do my own which was not sleeping during the first two weeks, always worry about my son crying.
I actually felt that I didn't enjoy him as a mom. I was always just, like, worried about him. I felt like as a new mom, this is not natural. After the first few years, I said to my husband, "I don't think I can go around as a graphic designer anymore, I want to do something better for my life to help other moms." I took the route as a newborn specialist, which I love, is something that makes me who I am now. Not only to helping mommies, I mean, it's a pleasure to know when a mom hires me. It's like a new experience because I learn, I feel like my babies are my teachers.
Not only that I learn from them, but it also helped me to become a better mom, and a better wife as well. After that, after 10 years, having my first, I had my second one and third and fourth, and I think I really now enjoy what motherhood is. Really, it’s how it was supposed to be with my first one. I feel like helping mommies helped me cure that soul that I couldn't give my best to my son, my first son, like just giving my best. When my mom hires me, it is a pleasure.
I know when I walk into their home and be able to give my 150%. Most importantly, what I always say to my mommies is like, "When I step out of the door, you guys will be the newborn specialist." That's my goal. My goal is for you guys to know how joyful it should be to becoming a mom. Not having the experience that I did. That is how I became a newborn specialist and how I'm still enjoying every baby. It's amazing for me to be, parents for the mommies.
Elara: In my mind and my experience, what makes Maria a newborn specialist is she's able to decipher the language that is newborns. In the beginning, from a first-time mom's perspective, babies are just crying and you don't know why. Then as time goes on, and especially after working with Maria, you begin to decipher, you begin to un-code what this language is, what they're trying to get across. Which I guess leads me to one of my first questions, and I think this is a question a lot of first-time parents have, second time, third time, fourth time. How do you get a newborn to stop crying?
Maria: There is a very unique technique that I use. I believe that every baby is different, but there's only one technique that I use for every single baby to stop them from crying. There is definitely one technique that I love to introduce to every single parent, and they see how easy the baby calms with me. I say to them, "It is not me, promise, it's not me. We'll wait for the baby to cry again and I will help you get through it so you will see how you actually stop the baby from crying."
Diana: What's the technique?
Maria: Let's pretend our baby is crying. Let's say nursing mommies. Where mommy is nursing the baby, baby's nice and calm, and after six, seven minutes, baby just unlatches and starts screaming. Our nature is like, come, you can nurse a little more, and the baby tries and screams again. We'll probably switch to the other side and the baby cries again and you're like, okay, something's going on in here. The best way at that point, keep in mind that when I'm nursing our babies are close to us. Now we have to keep our baby away from us because a baby's being close to us is comforting. "Wait a minute, why is my baby crying?"
Now we're going to stop the nursing and we want to focus on to figure out why our babies are crying by supporting baby's head, supporting baby's butt. You can actually stand up or you can sit down. Either one will work. When we are doing this technique, the most important thing that we'll have to keep in our mind is that we have to stay calm. I know it's so hard to use that word when our babies are crying, but you want to keep this in mind. When our babies are crying, they're only talking to us. They only they're probably saying, "Mommy, I need to burp. Mommy, I need more." That's how they say the word by screaming.
So very important when you're going to use this technique you want to keep in your mind that you are going to help your baby. That's number one, and it's extremely important. Because I have used this technique with parents that are not ready and I will know after I use this technique with parents that are ready and you see a very quick result. When we support the baby's head, support the baby butt, we're going to keep them away from us. Not this much, away from us. I'm going to say maybe about nine, 12 inches away from us. By supporting the head, supporting the baby butt, we are giving the baby the right support, supporting the head, supporting the baby butt.
Now we're going to keep our baby away from us. We want to swing them. Not high, not aggressive, just very calm and gentle. Now, keep something in mind. Baby's crying, yes.
So when babies are in the womb, they hear and they're familiar with loud sounds. Meaning the blood flushing as mommy's body, they hear the water, feeling like always moving. Then they hear all the background noise. It's very, very noisy inside. We don't know how high it is, but studies have come reveals that it's as loud as a blender, it's loud as a vacuum machine, is loud as a blow dryer. That's pretty loud.
If a baby cries, we cannot go shh, we have to go SHHHH. We also, when we shush, keep this in mind because we are calm, we're not going to go sh, sh, sh. No, we're going to go like shh, soothing shush, louder than our baby is crying. If we still hear our baby from crying and we don't hear our shushing, then that means it's not loud. Now, I'm not saying you should do it very close to your baby's ear. You want to do a nice and soothing away from your baby's ear, just loud. When you do this movement, which is the swinging, very softly, all these little things remind baby that, wait a minute, when I was in the womb when mommy used to walk and I used to go with the little swing, yes.
I used to hear this water sound and it's louder than anybody can hear me screaming. Now I'm away from my mommy because being close to my mommy is making me feel discomfort. Why? We'll find out why. All these little things and then the movement that we do with our hands and making sure, most importantly, we are 100% sure that we're going to stop our baby from crying, our baby will stop immediately, immediately. I can do this with any baby that's crying. I don't have to do it myself. I can guide mommies through it. Just remember one thing, if your baby, if you ever go through something that you don't like and it's more than two days, after three days becomes a routine.
Babies learns very quick. One mommy said to me, "Maria, my baby's crying, I don't know why." What happens at this time? I was like, "Okay, I will call you at five o'clock." She would say like, "It happened around 4:55." I was like, "Okay, great, I'll call you at five o'clock." Here it goes. FaceTime, baby is screaming, screaming, screaming, screaming, screaming, screaming. Mommy is like, "What do I do?" I'm like, okay, I guide the husband because her husband was holding the baby and we did this. They were like, "What did you do?" "It wasn't me; it was you guys. I wasn't holding the baby. I just guided you guys through it."
Then we'll find out what the baby needs. Because it's so important to understand that we have to stop our baby from crying, but then we have to provide, you figure out why our babies are crying. Every scene has their reason. After I find out a little bit more a background, I always say to parents, I'll recall what happened two hours ago. If you are feeding your baby's five o'clock and your baby is crying, and you go and go and recall what happened two hours ago, which means three o'clock. From 3:00 to 5:00, you kind of like figure out what is missing and that's how you actually get your answers.
Once a baby stop crying, we want to find out why our babies is crying. If your baby was nursing after six, seven minutes, the baby refused to go back but wants to go back, then that means the baby needs to burp. When the baby stops crying, the technique that we use to stop a baby from crying, we put baby on out shoulder because baby just finished nursing and you go focus is going to be on try to burp him. It may take a minute or two.
Normally a baby will give you a burp after that, and then you resume on feeding again and now your baby is not crying anymore. It can be different scenes, but that's the very unique technique that I use to every single baby that I truly believe they're all unique. That's the only thing that I have found out that it helps every single baby. That's how we find out how our babies needs the help to stop the baby from crying. Very easy.
Diana: You're a baby magician. Maria, I think that the newborn time is obviously such an intense time and can be really hard on parents and now it's something that you work with. That's what you do. You work with newborns. I'm curious, how do you take care of yourself and what lessons are in that that you could teach new parents? Because obviously, you figured out how to do this as a career whereas most parents only have a newborn for, I don't know, a month or so until they grow up a little bit. What are some lessons that you've learned in order to take care of yourself while taking care of a newborn?
Maria: We tell our body what to do. Our mind is the smallest part of our body, but it's the strongest part of our body. We tell our mind that we are not tired when we are tired, and our body doesn't know that we're tired. The body doesn't tire because our mind is telling you I'm not tired. That's number one. After that, again, every baby is different. Sometimes we have babies that are up at nighttime because they need comfort. Sometimes they are up because they burping, gassy, or sometimes they are up because they need feeding.
When you understand that this is specific baby doesn't mean to keep you awake every hour or every 30 minutes, and you understand that it is this little body it's just uncomfortable because it's fussy. It's just uncomfortable because it's gassy. It's just uncomfortable because it's probably hungry. Then you put it in your mind that you're helping this little baby. It's not going to be 24 hours. It's going to be maybe six hours. I normally say to parents, don't look at the time if you are by yourself. Because time can be a little frustrating because you're like, "I've been putting my baby for an hour to sleep and he's not going to sleep."
That's when frustration come and takes over your body. When we know that this is just temporary, I look up my time because I like to tell mommies what I went through. In my mind, the clock is just so I can share with parents. Not for me to get frustrated, because I know the reason why this baby is waking up. As Elara knows, I do take four hours of break, that's when I pass out if I was tired. Mentally I'm always positive because I know this baby doesn't mean to make your life not happy. He's already going through something, and we have to understand that we're here to help them.
When you put that in your mind, things go as smooth as they need to go. Now, the other thing that I do tell parents and sometimes I game a little bit because sometimes, keep in mind that if you don't sleep, you need to nurture your body by food. Our body nurtures by food or sleep. If we're up in the middle of the night, I like to only drink some water. If I'm up and I feel like my body is telling me is getting into you. I take a bite or something, energy. It could be the protein. It can be like any small like piece of chicken.
Elara: Cheese stick. Maria likes cheese sticks.
Maria: Correct. Or crackers. I like to go more the protein because the protein give you very fast energy just in case the baby is up. Sometimes I go for sweet, which I shouldn't go but I do. I'm just like if you're happy. Then those are the things that you nurture your mind to know that this is okay and it's temporary. Once you do that, and then obviously you listen to your body and relax, then you're back again. I do help my parents only two weeks straight, which means my body can go for 14 days without sleep. Then I obviously go home and relax and nurture my body again.
When I go home, I give my 100% to my babies, my own babies, my other babies and then I sleep. I'm a sleepy head. Sometimes I sleep 12 hours, 14 hours, 16 hours. I also go away a lot. I like to go be in nature and I kind of like nourish my body again, my mind again. That's just how I think it's easier for me to go on because I see things as like, yes, this is what I do for a living, but most importantly I feel like I'm helping a little person and the little person is going to help the family. Then when I leave, it's a happy family and I'm also happy too. It's all win-win.
Elara: One of the things you touched on Maria with your example is breastfeeding, and sometimes a baby crying in the middle of breastfeeding. I think that there's this idea that breastfeeding and nursing in particular is this really lovely bonding experience with your baby. It can also be really stressful and you can find yourself thinking, "I don't even think that this baby wants to nurse. Should I be pumping and doing bottle feeding? Should I be doing formula?" Kind of knowing when it's working and when it's not working, I guess it's very nuanced in my experience. In your opinion, could you give an example of when a mommy you've worked with has been nursing, and for some reason in that scenario it was better for her to switch to pumping or to formula?
Maria: The only time I may suggest to a mommy to use a bottle is when I know that a mommy getting slightly stressed. When mommy is worrying too much or even just worrying. Because once a mommy gets to the stage-- and let's go back in how the mind can take over your body. Little tiny thing can just take over the whole big thing, which is our body. It's not going to work anymore. There's a lot of mommies that they can go and like give it a break. Let's come back. Let's switch position. Let's just do other stuff. Let's just play music. Let's just sing.
There's so many different things. I will have to work with the mom and once I realize that mommies unfortunately went through a different stage or if I see slightly decrease on the supply and a baby wants more. Because at that point it's not up to mommy. It is not up to mommy. I'm able to recognize those little few things, but also, I will recognize with mommies too if I'm not present. That will be the only two ways when I may suggest for mommies to pump and give the bottle, or to introduce a formula, or to just switch to bottle.
Elara: What about the case of-- and I know this firsthand- of a mommy that has oversupply? A lot of people think that having lots and lots of milk it's not stressful, it's a wonderful thing, but it actually can be just as stressful in some ways as an undersupply of milk.
Maria: A mommy that has oversupply of milk, again, now let's go back on the baby. Keep in mind that when a mommy nurses a baby, it's teamwork. Right now, it could be the mommy has not much supply and baby wants to nurse. It could be that mommy has a lot of supply and baby cannot take too much. If that is our case, then obviously there's a few little things that I suggest to mommies to do. There's positions, there's probably like pressing a little bit, probably pumping a little bit.
I'm the person that likes to work with as the time goes on. I'm the person who say, "Let's go with the flow," because I can be with one mommy today, and in two days things happens, things change. I like to always introduce to the mommy what we're going through because I'm the person when they're with the mommy, my 100% is mommy, baby, family. I have my own, but I kind of put them little around the side. It's just the best for me, for the baby, even for my family.
I'm not going to not give my 150% and giving my sons and my family, and not be able to provide and do my best with my mommies. When I'm there, I'm always watching little things. Once I figure out and I have introduce everything combined, it’s easier for me to let mommy know this is what we are going through, this is what we probably should do. It all depends, unfortunately, for every specific mommy and babies. In my opinion, those are very unique, very, very unique.
Diana: Maria, you mentioned that with your first kid that it was a little bit harder and that bonding was a little bit trickier just because you didn't know what he needed and it was that you were going through your own things. That with your other kids, you figured out how to be a great mom, and so that bonding was a little bit easier. For a lot of women, they don't necessarily bond with their babies right out of the gate. That can be so challenging, I think, for women because the expectation is that you have a baby and you immediately are obsessed and love your baby. Do you have any advice for women who may be going through that or who have a fear of not bonding immediately with their baby?
Maria: Yes. The first thing, going back to, again, is be positive. Once our babies are not in the womb anymore, and when they're right here with us, we have to be positive in the sense of like, "You were safe in the womb, and now I'm going to make you safe. I'm going to keep you safe. I'm going to help you. We're going to get through this together." Again, once you have that in your mind, things get smooth as easy as possible. If a mommy would love to nurse, things become a little more easier because you can do skin-to-skin.
Then you can see how comfortable and happy your baby is when you're nursing him, you can see your baby's happy, your baby's sleeping, all those things to a mom, it helps us feel happy because our babies are sleeping, our babies are comfortable. Let's go back. If a mommy don't want to nurse, it's okay too. We're obviously going to give them a bottle, but we're going to bond with our baby. We're going to put our phones away, we're going to put our screens away, and it's just a baby and us when we give them the bottle. Again, all that is just going to help you make sure that your baby's getting what they need.
When you see the results, you're happy because your main goal is to make sure you're going to make this baby strong and happy and go on with his new life. Also, there's little things that I like to introduce to parents. It's like a little bit of playtime, a little bit of a reading. Things that don't involve only feeding our babies and putting them to sleep. When your baby is awake, you can do a little bit of playtime. That puts us together because we see our baby doing stuff, thinking with their head, using their fingers to touch something. It's always not only feeding, crying, and diapers, there's other more things better than just that.
Then also you have like the reading, which babies obviously will know when they are out of the womb. They hear everything. They don't need to visualize any book, but they are happy just to hear your voice, mommy's voice, daddy's voice. There are also a few ways of how daddy also can do this bonding as well if you guys could talk about it too as well. Just with mommy alone, there's other few little things that we can introduce by just not only feeding, not only nursing, but there's other things that we can do with our little people. I call my babies little person because they're a little person.
There's the same thing. We do exercises, we do playtime, obviously the bath, the routines, morning routine, the nighttime routine. It's so important to understand that the day starts and the day ends. Other than that, you feel like, "Oh my God, all 24 hours with the baby, how is this going to happen? How am I going to keep on with the life and with him?" You also have your me time. Especially when I went through myself, there's so many things that we can do with our babies if we treat them as a little person. There's nothing different between them and us. It's just tiny person that instead of saying, "Good morning, mommy," they say, "Wah," in the morning. That's it. That's the only difference.
Elara: True. As far as when you're a nursing mommy with a newborn, the first couple of weeks, it can be really hard on a dad. I'm just saying this from firsthand experience because inevitably nursing, it is a bit of a bonding process. You're their food source. It's a really rewarding experience. Then daddies they're sitting and feeling like the second-string quarterback. Could you just give some examples, Maria, of how you can really help dads bond with their baby?
Maria: Sure.
Elara: And what the mom can do as well. Because I do think that there is a bit of motherly instinct where you get a little territorial, especially when the baby's crying and you think, "Oh, I know how to comfort the baby. I can just feed the baby." The dad is trying to help. What can the mother do and what tips do you have for the dad to help them bond?
Maria: I love that question because I feel like-- as you guys know, when we have our babies, we bond a little bit faster, but unfortunately, our daddies can be a little bit left out. Not only because they cannot bond to the baby right away, but also keep in mind that when we become a mommy, unfortunately, unconscious we become a mom first and we forgot that we are a wife. We forgot that we have our own life as well because we devote to our babies. Sometimes that can make daddies a little bit left out. Now it's a third person, which is the two of you guys together, but unfortunately, they can go mommy’s time.
The best way, two things. One of them is daddy care. Just like a mommy's bond with baby skin-to-skin, it's in my opinion one of the most important things for babies to do with their dad, skin-to-skin. Just baby in the diaper, daddy in no shirt, and you cuddle with the baby. Now it helps a lot in a lot of different ways. One of them with a mommy sees this scene of our baby being calm in our husband's chest. If a mommy is nursing, help release more oxytocin because oxytocin is a hormone of love. How lovely is that to see our husbands with our baby calming like relaxing? So loving, yes?
That alone is introducing a hormone of love to become more and that's how we produce more milk. Now, let's say we're not nursing, that's also fine. That's a little not great, but a little time that mommies can have the me time while our daddies and our babies are happy and content. Why is baby content? Because our baby's in skin to skin with the daddy, and daddy transmit his own heat to our baby. The best heat that no clothes can provide. What I'm trying to say is our babies get so comfortable and cuddling with daddy skin, and now they hear the heartbeat.
You going to put your baby by the heart, so the baby hears the heartbeat. That's going to help our baby to feel comfortable because he hears his soft white noise. What a better place to be in a daddy's chest, nice body heat, and a nice soothing sound, which is my daddy's heartbeat. That's how babies recognize this is my daddy because he knows this is daddy, but he doesn't connect with him. The more they do it, the happier mommy will be because she has me time. If mommy would like to have the me time because knowing that the baby and the daddy are comfortable.
Husband is amazing, happy, because this is my me time with my son, with my daughter, with my baby, and the babies are happy because no better place to be than be cozy and cuddling. That's number one. The other thing that I do and love to suggest to parents is that we have routines, morning routines, nighttime routines. Majority of parents, I'd like to introduce them so that they could probably take over because, again, this is my routine with my son, with my babies. This could be introducing the bath. It could be dressing him and then mommy can take over.
Those little things that we probably don't know that it's big. It would turn to a big thing for our babies and for our daddies to know, "I'm helping my baby. I'm bathing him. I'm helping him to start his nighttime routine. I'm helping him to start the morning routine." Those are things that we connect to our babies. That's how daddies and mommies and everyone is happy because everyone has their own different thing that they can do then. Another suggestion is letting daddies take over one of the routines. Now, one thing for mommies to keep in mind is that as a woman our body's structure is different.
Our hands are probably smaller than daddies. Our body is smaller than daddy. Sometimes for our daddies, when they hold the babies, as long the baby is being held by the daddy with one hand supporting the head and one hand supporting the butt. Our babies are safe because as babies get bigger, our hands don't get higher. Maybe it could be 6 pounds, 12 pounds, as long we're holding them right, and we're moving them different way by holding them right, our babies are safe.
If we're holding them by the arms, or by the neck, or by the head, it's supposed to be head, neck, and shoulder, open your hands nice and wide. If our daddies support our babies this way, our babies are safe. It doesn't matter how our husbands walk with them or put them up in their shoulder or cradle them. As long as they're supported right, they're okay. I have come across this sometimes when mommies used to say to the daddies, "But you're not holding him like Maria. You're doing different than Maria." I'm like, "Well, I'm more smaller. I'm more skinny. My hands are more smaller."
I need to see how comfortable the daddies are with the babies and how safe the babies are with their daddies. That's all that matters. Calming them down, it will take over because daddies feel comfortable. That's like number one thing to have, is, in your mind you're going to help your baby. In your mind, you're going to succeed because that's goal in your mind. That's the goal, so it's going to happen. It will happen because when we said something our words are stronger and it will happen. Just letting mommies know that our babies are safe, our daddy will calm them and everything's going to be great. They're okay to help our babies.
Diana: Give them a chance. [laughs] Maria, what are some common newborn stages that you see? Do you see a very common progression and the babies that you work with? They go from this stage to this stage and then here they become a little bit more independent, or you do different things with them at night or you help them in different ways at night?
Maria: I normally see babies' newborn stage which is up to 28 days because my schedule is a little bit busy. I like to stay in touch with my mommies, the first year of baby's life. I see one-on-one the first two weeks, maybe the first few four weeks. After that I just see what mommies can give me the feedback in terms of how our infants are developing. How they doing in terms of completing their milestones, sitting down and crawling and walking and all that. Those are the things that I see as long as mommy will share with me, introduce with me. The one-on-one I always see them in the first 28 days.
It is amazing to see as a newborn how they develop every single day. Going back I was just explaining to you guys how we have to recognize our babies as small people. We obviously feed our babies, we play with our babies, we do storytelling, we do exercise with our babies. This is all fun time for moments that we go through them. I'm a true believer that our babies-- not what the book says that their baby sees at two months. Our baby smiles at two months. Our babies can roll at two months. Now because when we treat our babies as little person, our babies do this much sooner than what you can think of.
I have actually a few mommies that will contact me and say, "Maria, I went to the mommy in the class and let's say three months old, and my baby was a little bit different than the other babies." They were like, "What did you do different?" I said, "What? I have an amazing baby nurse who told me to do this at this age and I think it's actually helping." The mommies were like, "Well, clearly it’s helping because my baby's not what you're supposed to be." Again, let's not compare babies. Most importantly is what we know. If we understand our baby are small people, we do the same thing that we would like someone to be doing to us to our baby and that's all we need to know.
For example, I'm a true believer that narrating to our baby is the best thing that we can do to them because on a newborn brain there's a lot of neurons in there. They only need the connectors; the connectors are the words. The more we talk to them, the connectors will do their job and maybe baby will understand. For example, when I introduce parents to do the morning routine I always say, "Okay, let's clean the eye, and then let's clean their mouth." I always go right here. When we clean inside the baby's mouth, say, "Open, open, open, open." Remember repetition always gives a good result.
Then at probably two weeks old, three weeks old, we just go “open open open” and our baby opens her mouth and people like, "The baby just opened their mouth! How do they know that?" Because repetition. I would let them know even when our babies are sad and be they crying and, you have to acknowledge that they're sad. Let them know, "I know you're sad and I'm here to help you", or "Tell me what's going on." What are we going to do? They get soothed by voice because they know and they believe you're there to help them.
The more we do to our small little person, the more results we see. That's so important to do the narration. Let's say our babies are sleeping, and we're going to do the nighttime routine. Imagine if someone take you from sleeping and put you in the bathroom just like in the water. "What did you just do to me?" It's nothing different for our babies. I want to let them stretch. We're going to let them just figure it out. I just woke up and you let them know, "Hey, you woke up," we're going to play, then we're going to go in the bath.
You say this to him before you do it and baby understands and make all those connections. Not only that you're having a happy moment with your baby. People ask me, “Maria, why do you talk the baby, the baby listening to you?" I'm like, "More than you can think of." The more we narrate to our babies we feel like we're now doing someone and for something. We doing something for our little people, a little baby. Then you just go on and the day happy because you are communicating with this person, and you're going to see the results day by day. It's amazing how you can see these results.
Babies starts seeing five weeks old, start smiling at five weeks old, and sleeping good and they’re cooing, and talking to you. And they are rolling and picking up their head and so much things. Every day it's a happy day because we are doing something where I'm a small person. It's very interesting for me and I love-- sometimes I stay a little longer and I can see that they will smile when they coo because when I'm there for the first two week they only look at me. After that, they smile and they hear and they can tell they look at my lips and my mouth when I say something.
They just start cooing and it my melts my heart. That's like my reward, going back and how we can straighten our babies out, our vision when we started introducing them black and white books putting in black and white and red. That's when you see the babies sees red and then all the colors. It's just very fun what we can do with a little person and you just see the results. It's amazing. as you treat them as a small little person, you'll acknowledge that, "Oh, this is what my baby's supposed to be doing." Then you just…it’s fun.
Elara: My experience the first two weeks you're running on the high of having a baby. You don't want as much sleep. You want to be there for everything, but it's really important to rest. The baby’s, in my case, in my experience, he was eating really well and then he would fall asleep. I thought, "Oh, this is wonderful." Then when we hit about-- I think it was like three and a half four weeks, it got a little bit tougher. He had a growth spurt. He seemed like he was really hungry, much hungrier than the amount that he needed to be getting from a physical standpoint in terms of ounces to how much he weighed.
He had a lot of tummy troubles; he couldn't eat so much at a time. He used to be able to, I'd nurse him in 10, 15 minutes, he'd be done. He would sleep for a couple hours and then it turned to-- it took me an hour, maybe an hour plus to nurse him in one sitting because he had to constantly burp. He was squirming. He had gas issues. One of the things Maria told me that I didn't know- was that around three to five weeks it's quite common for babies to go through a phase of having a bit more gas. A bit more intestinal discomfort because they're growing. They're going through a huge growth spurt.
They're having growing pains and it's all very normal. I think one of the things that Maria really taught me as far as when you're reaching that second phase of the newborn phase, it's 28 days. That second half it's really important not to define your baby as anything. For example, my husband, Peter, was quick to be like, "Do you think that he has colic?" Is he suffering from colic? Is he crying too much? By definition, a colicky baby is a baby that cries more than-- I think it's three hours a day or something like that.
Going back to Maria's point when babies are crying, they're trying to communicate and it's all very normal. It's a day-by-day process and you can't over label it. I do think there is this desire by a lot of new parents expecting parents to be like, "All right, what are the correct phases that my child's going to be going through?" Every baby's different, every mom and dad is different. It could last for maybe a week; it could last up to six weeks. I think that at this point right now- Koa, our son, he's seven weeks today.
I'd say that he still has a bit of a sensitive stomach and we're adjusting to it. There's no, I guess set, time that certain-- I don't know, I don't like to get too fixated on milestones as a new parent for this reason because I just think that it's so different. To Maria's point, you have to go with the flow and just be positive. It's about not oversimplifying or just putting a label on your baby. You're going through this process with them. It's their first time doing it, it's your first time doing it, so you just got to go through the flow and be as positive as you can.
Maria: Yes, I agree.
Diana: I love that. I think that was really good advice Elara.
Elara: Firsthand knowledge right there.
Diana: I think, Maria, in an ideal situation everyone would have a village supporting them with a baby. For a lot of new parents the reality is that it's just on the two of them or maybe even you're solo. What advice do you have for someone who can't afford the help or doesn't have that community surrounding them in that newborn stage?
Maria: Yes, very few simple things. Just like earlier everything that we spoke, which is stay positive. Knowing that you're here to help your baby, knowing that you're going to help your baby, that's the first thing. Second of all, if your baby is going through any stage to where your baby is crying or you just can't find out why your baby's crying. Just saying, "Stay positive." Introduce the technique to stop crying your baby. Try to figure out what the baby needs could be burp, could be feeding, could be a diaper change at that point, but it could be the poop change, not the wet diaper, and just resume and go on.
Don't worry about the clock. Your baby is up in the nighttime. Take a little bite of something, energy to keep going, and keep in mind that your baby does not want to keep you awake. Your baby is just going through something that we're going to find out. Third, talk to your baby about as much as you can. Introduce, narrate to your baby. It's going to be fun because you are not only just walking with your baby quiet. No, you are talking to a small person. Acknowledge that you have a tiny person with you and that it's going to be great for both of you guys.
Elara: That's good advice. I think another common question out there is scrolling Instagram, not in front of the baby, but when the baby is sleeping. A lot of different videos for advice, different influencers for advice, and there's so many different things out there. One of the things I was a little confused about is feeding on demand. Every time your baby cries my first inclination was, they must be hungry. That's the only reason why they're crying. I can just solve this problem by nursing them or giving them a bottle. Case closed, caso cerrado. In your opinion, is it a good thing to just be feeding on demand whenever the baby wants or do you stick to a routine? Do you meet somewhere in the middle? Does it depend on the baby?
Maria: It definitely fits in the middle depending on the baby. By keeping this very important thing in your mind, which is, recall what happened two hours ago. It says 4 o'clock, 4:00 PM and baby nursed at 2:00 PM. And you finish feeding him by 3 o'clock and it's 4 o'clock and your baby's crying and you think your baby is hungry. I don't think he's hungry. Give him the pacifier if you feel comfortable, but that means he's not hungry.
He can wait until 4:30. Sometimes we can teach our baby how to snack. That will be snacking. If baby had a really good feeding at 2 o'clock and finished feeding by like 2:30, and your baby slept and woke up at 3:50, he is probably hungry. Why? Because he slept, he digested his food, now he is ready for more. Always recall what happened two hours ago and you most likely will have the answer.
We stick with the routine. Routine helps our babies. Also, the other thing to keep in mind is that our babies are persistent, but we are consistent. Meaning we like to know a little bit more about how to help our babies because our babies will know we're going to make the right thing for them. That would be my little good points to keep in mind to recall what happened two hours ago and just stay consistent will help.
Diana: Consistency.
Elara: That's good advice. The other thing as far as looking back every two hours I have mommy brain, which means my memory cannot be trusted. One of the things that has been so important for me that I recommend to all moms and new dads out there keep a log. I like to do it the old-fashioned way. Where actually keeping it in a notebook, writing it down because it just helps stay in the memory a bit that way. You can literally look back and see the patterns and the iterations and think, "Oh, every three days, it's kind of like this. Oh, last week he did this."
The day before, you start to make connections that way. Keep a log. You can keep notes in your phone or you can write it down physically, but that is extremely helpful. You can physically look back. When I say log, I keep a log of when the baby was asleep, when he had a wet diaper, when he had a dirty diaper, so a poopy diaper. You can go into detail and even keep like burps as well. You can keep in wake periods like when he had good tummy time, and you start to see the patterns of these are all the things that he's doing.
When he's communicating, when he's crying, it's either he's hungry or it's he's overtired and needs to be little back to sleep. Maybe he has a burp. Maybe he's just feeling squiggly and gassy. Maybe he has a dirty diaper. A cool fun fact that I learned from Maria is that for most of the time when a baby has a wet diaper, you don't need to change it. I was over-changing my baby's diaper for the first month. I did not realize this. I thought, "Oh my god, it's wet, I got to change it. I got to see the little blue stripe."
Not true, babies are totally fine. When they've urinated you should not disrupt their sleep because then when you go to change their diaper, they're thinking, "Oh my God, I'm awake, I need to eat now," when they don't. You confuse them. When they have a dirty diaper, for the most part, they let you know-- and trust me your nose will also let you know it. If you have a dog, they will smell it as well. Things you learned, keep a log, it's going to make your life a lot easier.
Diana: Okay, Maria, this has been so wonderful and I really appreciate, Elara you coming on and speaking your personal-- what's been going on the last couple weeks for you and Maria, sharing all of your amazing advice. We love to end our podcast with asking our guests two questions. The first one is, what is a life lesson that you have learned the hard way?
Maria: This is obviously not related to what I do for a living, but what I have learned to make me who I am with my family as a wife. Growing up I was extremely jealous. When I met my husband, I was very crazy, jealous towards him, and it made me learn that as a human being you have to give wings to the next person just to fly. You have to be there to fly with them. You can't cut their wings and keep them in jar for you. That's not love. I used to look at myself at my mirror and used to say, "I'm not ugly. I think I'm cute. Why should I be jealous of him? Why should I just search his phone or his wallet for things that will only make me crazy?"
I'm going to stay positive and try to put the negativities away. If they're there I'll just put them away. I override positive always with what I do for a living, with my family, with my husband. It makes me a much better person, better wife, better mom. Even my older son, he says to me," You guys have a very good relationship. I was like, “Anthony, I was like the worst person ever to be with as a partner. I was like so jealous, and realized that was not living.” I was always concerned, I was always worried. I would say to myself, "I'm getting old and I'm not ugly. This cannot be life."
I learn that you just have to give wings to your partner and things going to be great and stay positive. They're going to do you wrong, it's going to happen because I'm not going to be together. It's going to happen. The moment that I'm here with you, I'm going to do my best and I'm just going to be positive and share my love. I learned that the hard way and I'm still with him. I'm 22 years, I'm in love with him like ever. I have four kids, some amazing kids. It's nothing better than just like see your partner as a friend when you guys are together. Love is in the air and in the house and everything is positive. Don't be jealous. It's not worth it.
Elara: Don't be jealous. Yes. I can relate to that one from a previous relationship. Yes, it's important to give your partner space to fly. Next question, our follow-up question, which I feel like you touched on a bit with the previous answer is, what's a mantra that you live by besides stay positive? I'm going to throw in that caveat because I know that you're extremely positive. What would be another undercurrent for you in your life journey that you'd want to share?
Maria: Possibility is one of the very important powerful things to bring to your life and everything that you do for a living. Love is important. Staying positive, my opinion overrides everything. Even when I'm sick, I don't like to share it to my family that I'm sick. They will see me and they're like, "Are you okay?" I'm like, "Oh yes, sure, I'm okay." If I tell my mind, I'm sick, believe me, I'm sick. I remember when I had my fourth baby, it was very, very, very quick. I couldn't have an epidural. I remember I was crying for very painful pain. My husband says, "Why are you crying?" "I was just so happy when I had the baby."
Believe me, I was crying for pain. Then I remember saying to myself, "If I let my body know that I am weak, that I'm going through pain, but wait a minute, this baby had to know." I'm going to have to just stay strong and stay positive that my baby needs to make it to this world, and I'm the one who's going to need to provide this. I have to feed my mind to stay positive. It's going to happen; it's going to be great. That's what happened. Afterward, I told my husband it was like someone was ripping my heart out like seriously. That's how I told him about it. It was so painful. Staying positive helped me make it through and I was able to see him.
Elara: Mind over matter, Maria is the epitome of that. Maria, it has been such a pleasure. I could continue picking your brain for several hours. As far as our listeners out there or any watchers, if you would like us to have Maria back on the podcast, you have other questions that we didn't get to today, I understand. Feel free to drop them in the comments below and maybe we'll have Maria back on to touch on some other life stages as we move through motherhood, because I know that Diana and I are definitely going to be interested.
Maria: Thank you very much for having me. I hope this can touch the majority of mommies. My goal has always been, if I'm not present to introduce the little that I knew, I would love this word to spread to all the moms and to be able to pick up some little guys. Hopefully, it's helped the majority of mommies that can listen to this. Yes, thank you very much, Diana. Thank you very much, Elara. It's been amazing to be here.
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Outro: Sip, savor, and live well with new episodes of The Matcha Guardians every Wednesday. Follow our show for free on Apple, Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you're listening right now. Leave your questions and comments below. Find us on Instagram @thematchaguardians or click on matcha.com.